Mayor of NYC Knows What's Important - Page 2

The whole Indian thing just strikes a chord with me plus i added it cause if i didnt i wouldn't have had anywhere to stand on the we should speak one language here issue and that the Language should be English.

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ORIGINAL: Lugnut

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... if i cant understand u i am not afraid to tell someone i cant understand them.

If you're at a service window and can't understand what the person is saying and you need their help, of course you tell them you can't understand them. What other choice do you have? There's no reason for either of you to get mad. Where does that get you?

Alot of people i know will not say anything if they cant understand someone even if it means that they did not get what they wanted or needed its sad cause these people are mostly in my generation and dont have the balls to say "hey i can't understand u" and like it or not these type of people are more numerous than the those like me that will not leave until we are satisfied.

Right or wrong, English is the official language in America. Lets' just establish that right now. Everyone who lives in America should strive to learn English. However, unless a person wears a signs that states, "I'm one of the ones trying to learn English," how can you tell? Give folks a chance is all I'm saying. Being rude or mum gets you nowhere. The type of thing I don't like is teaching English as a second language in our American schools, for example.

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ORIGINAL: Lugnut

The type of thing I don't like is teaching English as a second language in our American schools, for example.

I'll go one step farther than just not liking it i dont think its right. Yes teachers need to understand that these students may need more help but if i am a history or science teacher i dont plan on slowing down my lesson plan hurting the English speaking students to accomodate the non-English speaking students and will go as far as to say that it is the parents reponsiblity to flip the bill for the extra pay that the taxes payers would have to pay to have this person learn English. just if i moved to say Germany i would not expect there tax payers to pay for my English speaking child to learn German.

Whether right or wrong, it's hard to stop the trend when the student is a foreigner, the teacher is a foreigner, the school board are foreigners, the county commission are foreigners, the mayor is a foreigner, the citizens are mostly foreigners, etc.

I think this all boils down to standardized testing. I personally love it pass u move to the next level if not tough s***. The fed gov't will pay for a persons k-12 education until they are 21 so u have that long to get though school if u cant do it by then well once again tough s***. I dont wanna here well i am not a good test taker BS either guess what LIFE is a test so children learn early pass or be passed over!

I can't tell you how many people I've met, even with college degrees, that can't write worth a poop. I'm not talking about just spelling. Many "educated" people who were educated in America can't express their thoughts in writing. Some can't even read. They can read words, but they get no meaning from a page full of words. There are a bunch on this site as well.

Standardized tests? What a crock. This is a teacher's excuse for sitting on their ass. The tests can weed out the true losers, I suppose, but they don't identify any over-achievers. That's not what government schools do, though. They're in the business of advancing students to higher grades. It doesn't matter how they perform in lower grades. We don't want to adversely affect their self-esteem but holding them back until they learn something.

Well i am not going to lay out my entire standardized testing plan but it would be able to identify over achievers as well as identify the career route that will not only make the person most happy with life but also the most useful Though i know most useful sounds kinda 1984ish. I will assume u know i mean the book. I say screw self-esteem cause guess what if u inflate at student's self-esteem too much they will feel they are above doing work and that inturn makes a less useful person and in the end will cause them more grief casue they will never get to where they were once told they could get. Perfect example: In American anyone can be President no not true the guy with CP or a learning disability will not become the leader of the free world and neither will the guy that just did enough to get by while he was in high school.

I'm talking about real life, not some pretend test you thought up and no one uses.

My point is that a test doesn't teach, it measures. We need good teachers in good schools. Then we can worry about measuring with tests. What's the point of measuring students who haven't learned anything or who haven't been taught anything? Your putting your cart ahead of your horse.

I guess i just got lucky i went to public schools and i recieved a really good education maybe its because i was willing to put forth an effort when needed. I had some poor teachers i mean my 11th grade English teacher asked me what grade i wanted i said i'd be happy with a B he said its done and this was b4 the year was half over. I am also looking at testing also for placement into higher classes or lower classes depending on what is needed. And the results need to be part of ur education records even so colleges or employers can see them. Would u hire someone that took two years or just one year to get though the same class with the same teacher assuming that everything else was equal? This is just a simplified example.

Well, I know you want me to say the student who took one year. It depends. I wouldn't want that student if they just asked for a "B" and got it. But high school doesn't teach you much in terms of job skills. Really, what's the difference if I'm hiring a recent high school grad? I'd pick the person who impressed me the most, who looked me in the eye and spoke clearly, who didn't stutter and ramble, who sat up straight and looked like they wanted to learn and then help. I might even choose a dropout over a grad if the person made a good impression on me.

For a skilled or professional job, school records (college or tech training grades and test results) would be more important. I wouldn't give a damn about high school standardized tests, though.

I see nothing wrong with hiring the drop-out over the grad but that is were pre-employment screening and testing comes into play. It pisses me off when jobs say college degree need for something that i could have easily done b4 i graduated high school my point about the one or two year thing is that it is obvious that both people could do it yet it took the other guy twice as long and in a fast paced industry that would be no good however if u dont need someone that is fast paced offer the job to the guy that took two years at lower pay and u will have a way to justify it.

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It pisses me off when jobs say college degree need for something that i could have easily done b4 i graduated high school...

It's the job market that allows employers to do that. When there's an overabundance of available people they can do stuff like that.

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... my point about the one or two year thing is that it is obvious that both people could do it yet it took the other guy twice as long...

Doing something quicker doesn't mean it will be done better. I understand what you're saying, but taking extra time to do something isn't ALWAYS a negative.

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ORIGINAL: Lugnut

Doing something quicker doesn't mean it will be done better. I understand what you're saying, but taking extra time to do something isn't ALWAYS a negative.

True and some employers may look at it that way and employ him over the other guy especially if they need someone that will make sure something is 100% correct b4 doing it. Carpenter saying measure twice cut once.

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Carpenter saying measure twice cut once.

Brain surgeons too.

I would hope so.

The new English, "Jafaican." Languages do evolve, I guess.

Your educated. What do you think we need to do to get students to learn? OR, How do we improve teaching?

Personally, I think bringing discipline into the class, and more latitude for teachers to create lessons, would help a great deal on teaching. Students must be held to standards of good behavior and rewarded for it. Oh, and teach only in a proper english language environment.

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ORIGINAL: BikerDrew

Your educated. What do you think we need to do to get students to learn? OR, How do we improve teaching?

Personally, I think bringing discipline into the class, and more latitude for teachers to create lessons, would help a great deal on teaching. Students must be held to standards of good behavior and rewarded for it. Oh, and teach only in a proper english language environment.

teachers should have to do less paperwork and do away with block teaching. it doesn't help.

definately should be allowed to bring more discipline in the classroom. of course, some of the parents need to be educated as well. also, don't teach kindergarteners how to use a calculator before they learn to use the one they were born with! learn the basics with your mind and then teach them how to use tools. unless a child is doing math way beyond their normal level, a calculator should not be used until in high school.

they should also do away with multiple choice answers and fill in the blanks. a child cannot learn to write a coherent sentence if they are not taught to do so from the beginning. remember when you had to write the question as part of the answer?

spellchecker on the computer is also bad for kids. why worry about spelling a word correctly when the computer will do it for you.
i could go on and on, but i won't bore you.

this rant brought to you from a parent volunteer in pre school, elementary and middle schools for over 10 years.

I dunno. It's too broken and I don't have the proper background to know how to fix it. I'm talking about public schools. "Who broke it" is the question. Decide who that is and fix them first.

You seem to be saying it's the students' fault. I don't think that. I'm not saying they're angels, but it's not their fault they're not. When I went to school, teachers ruled. They had absolute control. Someone has so thoroughly taken that control away from today's teachers that they can no longer teach effectively.

the board of education took control away.

i was not saying it is the kid's fault. it is the fault of the board of education that says teach them this way. kids only learn what they are taught. plus it is really hard for a kid to learn when other kids are being disruptive.

the teachers hate that their hands are tied in how they teach children nowadays. they have no room for creativity in how a lesson is taught and are on a time limit. it is really hard to get into (sink your teeth into) a lesson when you have only 20 minutes to do so. it is very frustrating.

I was responding to Drew, actually.

When I went to high school, one vice principal's nickname was Bullwhip. Bullwhip Griffin. The damn guy was scary. He had a big 'ol bullwhip wound up and hanging on the wall behind his desk. If you had to "go see him" you had to look at that bullwhip while he chewed your ass. He never took it off the wall, of course, but we were too dumb and scared to figure that out.

The other vice principal was also the gym teacher. He was about 6'8" and 240 lbs or so with no body fat. If you had to "go see him" he would stand up and get right in your face and yell you down. Nobody, I mean nobody sassed that dude.

If a student would rather cause trouble instead of learn and was disruptive, no one cared about their self-esteem or whether they would be traumatized for life. They simply had their attitude adjusted. Bullwhip or the gym teacher saw to that.

i'm sorry i misunderstood you.

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